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Dr. Martin Shaw talks with Ian MacKenzie in an interview for The School of Mythopoetics.

In myth, the Underworld is a place of testing and initiation, but hopefully not a final destination. Within many stories the descent is the second element of a three stage process, leading to final grounding that is both redemptive and a gift to others.

Martin Shaw is suggesting in the West we have often made the Underworld so comfortable, so subtle, and in some case so chronic, we’ve become a two stage, not three stage culture. Without quite knowing it, the Underworld has become home. In this state we experience the liminoid not the liminal, the rupture but not the rapture. Nothing grows, expect cynicism. Come and join Martin as he speaks old world stories and ideas into the malaise of our times.